Episode #133 – Why You Need to “Empty Your Cup”

Coach Joon is back!

We're chatting today about how you need to let go of what you've learned up until this point to in order to learn the H2H method.

If you try to fit all your previous learning into the H2H method you're going to get seriously frustrated.

We explain why in this episode.

Give it a listen.

???? Check out the free H2H training below!

EPISODE 133 TRANSCRIPTION

When you're up against a hostile room of people who don't want to be there, you need real strategies that get results. Welcome to From Hostage to Hero, the show that gives you practical advice you can use right now in the courtroom, boardroom, or classroom. Learn how to move your unwilling audience to one that is invested in what you're saying, eager to participate, and engaged in the process. Learn from the attorney whisperer herself, your host, Sari de la Motte.

Sari de la Motte:

Well, welcome everybody to another episode of From Hostage to Hero. Sari de la Motte here, the attorney whisper. And today we are bringing back Coach Joon to talk about emptying your cup. Welcome Coach Joon.

Coach Joon:

Thank you for having me. I'm so honored to be back again.

Sari de la Motte:

Yay.

Coach Joon:

Thank you.

Sari de la Motte:

And let's just for listeners who are new to us. Why are we calling you Coach Joon? Well, Coach Joon, Joonho Hong works in the From Hostage to Hero, well, I should say H2H Crew, which is our paid membership. And if you are not in the Crew, why are you not in the Crew? It is awesome.

Now when this podcast drops, we have closed already, but we will be reopening January 2022. So you want to make sure to go to fromhostagetohero.com and get on the wait list so that you can work with me, and Joon, and we have guests, and it's cool. And it's awesome. And Joon, do you want to say anything about the membership before we get into our content today?

Coach Joon:

Yeah, I mean, I love the membership. The best part I love about it is the community. I mean, it is so beautiful. The support everybody gives each other. And I mean, I did not expect it to be what it is, and it's just so beautiful to see how everybody pulls through for each other and just sharing their time, knowledge, and love with each other. It's a beautiful thing.

Sari de la Motte:

Yeah. And I think that's been surprising to a lot of our members. Just the other day, Kristi, our admin posted in the group, what do you love about H2H and one of the responses was how nonjudgmental it is. And then she added, the Crew member added and that's been hard to get used to. And I thought that was an interesting comment because I think we're so used to being judged and yet in the Crew, we definitely give you feedback as we talk about, you know, they're the four pillars of mastery. One is training, one is feedback, one is practice, and one is community. So we definitely give you feedback, but it is in a way of loving feedback, I guess, is the word that I would use of how we do that. Yeah, and how-

Coach Joon:

And sometimes you give a little tough love.

Sari de la Motte:

Yes, for sure. And especially in my podcast, I'll take people down for their bullshit thinking, which I think is helpful. And what do you do in the membership? What are the things that you do?

Coach Joon:

Yeah. So the main things that I do are the learning lab. So we have the Voir Learning Lab and the Nonverbal Learning Lab. And to kind of give an idea. So with the Voir Learning Lab, it's really an opportunity, that's why we call it Learning Lab where we sit together and we work through an issue-oriented voir dire, right? And so, the idea is we work through it, whether you bring a case that you're currently working on, or we make up something and you bring it and hopefully you'll bring it to one of the hot seats, the Voir Dire Circle. So now, you know what you're looking for in terms of what questions you want to ask, and what sequence you want to do it, and you practice it. And that's the whole idea. And then if you like to say you went to the Voir Dire Circle and you're like, ah, that didn't land so well, I didn't think, come back to another Learning Lab and then revisit it and try to make it better. So that's the whole idea with these Learning Labs.

Sari de la Motte:

Yeah, that's awesome. And that's exactly what we're trying to do with the membership is, there's the book, From Hostage to Hero, which you get at as a member, but it's not enough just to read a book. We want you to have a chance to practice, and get feedback, and work with a coach.

All right. Well, join the membership. That's our little message there, for today because we are having so much fun back there. And our Crew members are so much fun, and they just love each other, and we love them. And it's just a whole love fest. Let's just put it that way.

But today we are talking about the concept of emptying your cup and how this is absolutely essential when it comes to learning the H2H method in particular, but really learning anything. So before we jump in, let's talk, because Joon, you kind of brought this up in the crew and that's what gave me the idea to do a podcast on it. What does this mean to empty your cup? Kind of where does that come from and what made you bring it up?

Coach Joon:

Yeah. So for those of you who don't know, I grew up in a martial arts family, and what I mean by that is, my grandfather, he created the Federation that my father, my uncles, everybody were instructors and masters in called Tang Soo Do. Probably the most famous guy that people would know is that trained in our style was Chuck Norris, right?

Sari de la Motte:

Wow. I didn't even know that. That's super cool.

Coach Joon:

So the concept is I grew up with this where basically, in our style, most people think, oh, black belt, right? That's the top level you get. Well, in our style, we did not have black belts, we had midnight blue. And what that signified was, you are not fully complete, you never reach that top level because you are constantly always growing, evolving, and all that stuff. So never come to anything thinking that you know it all. Keep an open mind. Empty your cup. Yes.

Sari de la Motte:

Empty your cup. And you also said that this concept comes from some cheesy eighties movie as well?

Coach Joon:

Yes, it was called No Retreat, No Surrender. And the scene that this kind of played out was, so there's this young kid who knows martial arts, but he moves into a new town and he's getting bullied by other martial artists. And so, he goes to the grave site of Bruce Lee and he's like, oh, please, show me wisdom. And so the spirit of Bruce Lee comes to this kid. And so, Bruce Lee, on the first training session goes to the kid, okay, now get into this stance, or whatever. And the kid's like, oh, I already know how to do this. And Bruce Lee takes out two cups. And one cup, he goes, this cup represents you and it's filled with water. And he goes this cup, and it's a cup of soda, right, represents me, Bruce Lee. So he starts to pour the soda into the cup of water and then it starts spilling. So, then the little kid goes, he goes, no, no, no, don't do that. And so, Bruce Lee just goes, you see, if your cup is already full, you cannot accept and receive anything that I show you. And then he empties or dumps the water out of the cup and then pours a soda into the empty cup. Says, to receive my wisdom and my teaching, you must first empty your cup.

Sari de la Motte:

Oh, yes. I love that. Okay. We're going to talk about that in depth in just a minute, but let's first talk about what you and I are seeing as people try to learn the H2H method. What do you think is the biggest struggle or frustration for people when they first encounter this method? Or really any method? What do you think happens?

Coach Joon:

What I see is, how does this fit with what I already know? Hey, that's not the way I would do, but so and so does it this way and that other great trial attorney does it this way, but how does that fit into either one of those, and...

Sari de la Motte:

Or David Ball says never to, or Randy McGinn says always to, which Randy McGinn actually never says always to do anything, but the point is, being, yeah, they try to make this fit in their cup, already full cup. And why doesn't that work? Why doesn't that work?

Coach Joon:

It doesn't work, because it's basically when you're doing that, trying to take this new thing, new skill, or new information that you're learning and try to fit it into something within your world of knowledge, you're manipulating this new information and you're trying to make it fit, and then you're basically taking away the essence or the power of that new information. So, now it's whatever you made it into, that's not what it was. That's not what that information or technique is supposed to be. You just completely mutated it.

Sari de la Motte:

Yes, absolutely. And wouldn't you say too, and you can speak to this as your own personal journey as a trial attorney and then finding H2H, but wouldn't you say that it's like, seriously confusing out there to figure out how to do this "trial thing"? Yeah, what has been your experience and then how did H2H change that?

Coach Joon:

Yeah, that was one of the things that drew me to you when you started saying, oh, if you're the type of attorney that goes from CLE to CLE watch this DVD, or reads this book. And I was like, holy shit, that's me. Right? And I was like, because I got so fed up with that because it was so overwhelming. Before every trial I'm like, wait, okay, I got 10 books out, which one? But this one says this, but this one says that. And instead of spending time on actually working on the voir dire, or the opening, I'm debating which technique to use, and it caused so much anxiety. And I just got fed up with it and I listened to you. And I said, you know what? I'm going all in. Fuck this other shit. I'm going all in. Let's see what this is about.

Sari de la Motte:

Hey, I'm trying not to swear on this podcast because your kids listened to the last one, and now here you are swearing. So it's on you daddy, Joon.

Coach Joon:

Oops.

Sari de la Motte:

Don't listen to your dad, kids, when you listen to this podcast.

So true. So true. I mean, I think that's one of the reasons why people are so drawn to H2H is because we're like stop with all that shit. Now I get to curse. And because it's so adding stress and overwhelm to a job that is already full of stress and overwhelm, and instead, focus on mastering something for once. And again, we always say it doesn't have to be H2H. We think H2H is awesome and we love H2H, but just stop the searching. Just go all in on something.

So, let's talk a little bit about, okay, so we've already talked about how emptying your cup will be helpful to kind of come to this with a beginner's mind, but let's also talk about why that's so important, particularly for H2H, because as you and I were discussing before we started recording today, H2H has a completely different philosophy than most trial methods out there. What would you say is the biggest difference in the H2H method?

Coach Joon:

The biggest difference is really the philosophy and the mindset aspect. I mean, that mindset aspect, I mean, in and of itself is so transformational. That has really opened my entire world. And I see trial differently. I see everything differently, because I now, through all the mindset training that I've been doing with you and Coach K, I get to choose my thoughts. And when it comes to, you know, I see my adversaries and colleagues and they're all stressed out, I'm smiling. I'm like, hey, let's go.

Sari de la Motte:

Yeah. Yeah. And I think too, if we go back several podcast episodes ago where I talked about fear, that most of the trial methods out there deal in fear. Right? So instead of taking you out of fear and teaching you how not to be in a fearful place, they just continue to keep you in fear. And not only that, they put the jurors in a fear place. So everybody's freaked out. Everybody's scared. And so, that creates the exclusionary voir dire process. If we want to talk about that for a little bit, and how it's all about these people are here to kill you. So kill them first. So you go into that and you learn, I think throughout the years and years of training, well, I wouldn't even say you guys get years and years of training. It's just, this is kind of like you cut out of law school and you're like, oh God, these are the people standing between me and the verdict, how do I kill them?

And so you go into the trial process with that exclusionary voir dire, and From Hostage to Hero, as you and I were talking about, isn't necessarily the opposite. It's not, no, we love everybody and let's keep everybody. It's more about, there are people here that want to help you and you stand on the side of the right. And if you get down to the principles in your case, that will help you find your people. And in that process, we'll also find the people we don't want there. But I think that's a big reason too, of why you have to empty your cup, particularly for the H2H method, is that if you come in with the exclusionary, these people are here to kill me. They're my enemy, and you try to make this work with that. It's not going to work, speak a little bit to that.

Coach Joon:

Yeah. I mean, that's so a hundred percent true because if you're going in and I've done the exclusionary and I was able to just knock off panels and panels and panels, but then end up with still the shitty jury.

Sari de la Motte:

Exactly.

Coach Joon:

I was like, great, I've knocked off 60, great. I still got six that suck. Great.

Sari de la Motte:

Exactly.

Coach Joon:

And to put a little brain science into it, I mean, the whole reticular activating system, and this is why emptying your mind is so necessary, is because if we don't empty our mind and we still have that whole, oh, we got to do exclusionary, they're out to kill me, and all that kind of stuff. Guess what? Your brain with the reticular activating system, it's going to only filter in the information so you can only see the bad jurors. Right? And so, you can try doing the H2H method and try to do the designed alliance and all that kind of stuff. But when your subconscious brain is still having those thoughts underneath it, you're only going to still see the bad jurors, and you're going to start feeling, oh shit. And you're going to start acting like, okay, now I got to start knocking people off. So that's why you have to empty your cup.

Sari de la Motte:

Talk a little bit more about RAS for people who don't know what that is.

Coach Joon:

Yes. So RAS, the reticular activating system, I think the best way to explain it is kind of like with these examples, so ever had a situation where you're just driving on the road and you're saying, you know what? I'm going to buy this brand new red Maserati, right? But before you actually buy it, you never see a red Maserati on the road. Then the day you buy that red Maserati, then you start driving out on the same highway. Now, all of a sudden, everybody has the same red Maserati. You're like, what the hell? It's not because they all bought it at the same time you did. It's just the reticular activating system, because your brain is a machine that is all about efficiency. With all the information that's coming in, it has to filter stuff out. So when you focus on that red Maserati, because now you're focused on it. You just bought it. Now your brain is letting all that stuff in your reticular activating system is really just a filtering system. So yeah. That's what it is. Yep.

Sari de la Motte:

Yeah. And what's so great about that is that you can decide what your brain is going to filter. Right? So you get to decide, I'm going to focus on this, and then your brain gets to filter all the rest of it out. That's what's awesome about our brain. In fact, it was funny, I was just recording yesterday for our brand new time management course, Life By Design, which we are unleashing for free in the H2H Crew. So if you're a crew member, you get my shit for free as part of your membership. You pay for the membership events and you pay for the course that lives in there. But all the extra stuff is free, which all the rest of y'all have got to pay for. So another reason you might want to join the Crew.

But I was talking, one of the lessons in there is your brain, ally and asshole, right? Because your brain can totally work for you, but can also totally screw things up for you. And you have control over that shit. Right? But you've got to learn how to use your brain effectively. And in the course, we talk about how there's your prefrontal cortex, which is your thinking, rational brain. And there's your habit brain, which is your reactionary brain. And you actually need both when it comes to time management, for example, because your prefrontal cortex is the one that does the planning, right? It's the one that's thinking about, here's my goals. Here's how I'm going to achieve them. And then your habit brain is the implementator, right? It's the one that goes and then creates habits and makes sure that you actually are doing the things that you're doing, but you get to program that shit. And so, that's what's so great about what we're talking about is that you get to decide what you're focusing on and then your brain just comes along and goes, great, we're focusing on that. Let's focus on that.

So you're absolutely right. If you have this whole philosophy of, there are people here that want to hurt me, there are people here that want to kill me, and I got to find them first. But I'm also trying this H2H method, which says there are people here that want to help me, then it just screws up the whole thing. So that's a problem. So how do we empty our cup? Like how were you able to let go of all the learning that you had before and just come into this with a beginner's mind?

Coach Joon:

Yeah. I mean, I think one of the things for me was just, I had such a strong motivator of not wanting to feel so stressed out, and overwhelmed, and confused. Because that was a horrible way to try to case. I hated it. And I just said to myself, you know what, nothing else is working. I'm going all in. And I told myself, and I guess I was kind of doing mindset work before even knowing what mindset work was. I told myself, you know what? I believe that this is the answer. I went in as if, I'm like, okay. Beginner's mind and this is going to really be my thing. And I just went all in and went to your studios. I just followed your podcast, read your book. Actually reading it more than once, practicing, creating a habit. After the studio, when I first learned the designed alliance, I came back and I would practice the designed alliance at least 15 minutes every morning. Like while I'm doing my morning routine, I'd get up and drinking my coffee and I would just say it out and practice, practice, practice, practice, practice. And I did that for months so that now if I don't practice it and I just wanted to do it, I can still do it. And I'm like, okay, I got to brush up a little bit. Okay, in five minutes. I got it. You know?

Sari de la Motte:

Yeah. Yeah. Which is so huge, I think because when people, they're a small group of people, and I talk about this in a podcast previously, but who join H2H and they get the endorphins from that. They're like, oh, I'm doing something, right? I've joined this group. And then they never show up. They don't watch the course. They don't take a hot seat. And then a few months later they quit, and they're like, well, that didn't work for me. Well, yeah, of course it didn't work for you, because you're not actually participating.

Coach Joon:

You got to do the work.

Sari de la Motte:

It doesn't work to just buy the book. Doesn't work to just join a thing. I think that we've created a culture here in trial world of joiners, but never like participators, right? So we're all joining these new things and trying these new things. But nobody ever.. go full circle here actually buys in. And I think a big part of this emptying your cup, I think you're absolutely right, is the mindset work. Because to be able to let go of all the training and all the things that you tried beforehand is scary. It makes you feel a little vulnerable. You're like, okay, I've got to let go. Those things were things that protected me. Right? Sari's asking me to actually be vulnerable in front of the jury and trust them. That's a huge part of H2H, just trusting your jury. And to let go of the idea that they're my enemy. I think that takes a lot of trust.

And so, instead of just asking you to do that, we say, and we're going to give you the mindset skills to be able to do that, because it's not just, well, just flip a switch and now, do this and let go of all your old training. You got to do some mindset work around that. Talk to me a little bit about the importance of the mindset piece and why that's probably the most important thing that we cover in H2H.

Coach Joon:

Yeah. I mean, with the mindset piece, I mean like how you were talking about the automatic part of our brain, right? The subconscious part, I was actually just saying this to the Path to Master group yesterday. I've heard it said this way before, so our prefrontal cortex is like the Einstein part of the brain, right? The Albert Einstein. And our automatic subconscious brain is like Frankenstein. So if you picture Frankenstein versus Albert Einstein, and they were in a fight, who's going to win? Right?

Sari de la Motte:

Yeah. Yeah.

Coach Joon:

You can't outperform or you can't outdo your subconscious mind.

Sari de la Motte:

Yes. Yes.

Coach Joon:

So with the mindset work, it really helped me choose my thoughts and have those thoughts that are serving me to attain what goals I want to achieve. Have those actually be reprogrammed into my brain, and that become my subconscious thoughts, and that become automatic, and that become habitual. So now, when I'm confronted with any circumstance that used to evoke thoughts of, oh shit, how am I going to do this? Now it's like, oh, it is going to be fun, you know?

Sari de la Motte:

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, and that, wasn't something you could just do the minute you stepped into the H2H world, it took some training. And that's what we talk about at times in the H2H, we talk about brain science, we talk about rewiring your brain, and how we are wired to be in fear. Right? That's what our brain is meant to do is to make sure to keep us safe. And so, there's nothing wrong with that. There's a reason why all of you in this world are scared shitless because that's your brain is wired. But the other part about this is that you can rewire your brain. That's what's so exciting about this work, is you can rewire your brain.

And so, so much of H2H is helping you do that. And there was an interesting thread that you started this week, because every week, Joon posts in our H2H Crew, a Monday mindset video, or a post of some kind, and you had posted this last Monday, what do you think of when you think of mindset coaching? And it's so great that our numbers felt so safe to post what they really felt. And there was a lot of posts like, well, at first I thought it was, woo, woo. Or I thought it was bullshit. Or I thought it was snake oil. And then I realize that, well, first of all, there is a lot of that out in the world. So I'm not going to say that there isn't, there are people who just get certified online and from one day course and call themselves a life coach. Our process is much longer and much more intense, but they realize the mindset and how important it is as they get into it and find that their world is actually changing.

It reminds me of a podcast that I did a long time ago called, I think it's Learning How to Fly. I can't remember exactly the name and I should look these things up before I do it. But in that podcast, it talked about how this work is going from running to flying. And I think the better analogy now is it's kind of like, we're saying, look, you guys have learned how to walk and then you've learned how to run. But when you come to H2H it's like, now this is swimming, right? It's a totally different sport. And y'all are still trying to be like, okay, I'm going to go out and I'm going to run more miles. And we're like, no, no, no, no. You need to stop running and learn how to swim, because it's a completely different thing entirely.

I don't know if you know this Joon, and I just got an email this morning as somebody asked me to come speak on this because I think people are starting to freak out, but in Arizona they have gotten rid of peremptory challenges altogether.

Coach Joon:

I did not know that.

Sari de la Motte:

That is literally the new thing starting January 2022.

Coach Joon:

Wow.

Sari de la Motte:

What's your take on that? And how do you think H2H is going to be able to, our H2H people are going to be able to accommodate that? Because we do have several Arizona members.

Coach Joon:

Yeah. Well, first, the first thing that came on my mind is, oh man, a whole bunch of attorneys in Arizona is going to be, their saboteur's going to be like, holy shit, we got to learn how to do this exclusionary voir dire, and knock all these people off and learn how to knock them off for cause, because we don't have any peremptories anymore. Right?

Sari de la Motte:

Yes. Yeah. And they're going to dig deeper into that.

Coach Joon:

Now the way I'm thinking about it is like, okay, in New York, we get three peremptories, right? So I'm like, does it really even make that much of a difference? Oh, well.

Sari de la Motte:

Absolutely. I was just exactly what I was thinking. And I should have looked this up, but somebody emailed me something about how it's kind of a good thing that this is happening. But I absolutely agree. I think H2H was made for this situation entirely, because we look at peremptories as a nice little bonus. Like yeah, if there's some bad jurors on there, we can kick them off. But if you go back and you listen to the podcast, it's not the ideal juror, it's the ideal group. Right? We've always been about how it's the group that we're trying to form. And that no matter how many good jurors you have and the other side kicks them off, it doesn't matter if you do our group focused voir dire instead of individual focused voir dire because they can't throw off the whole panel that is now gelling around your theme.

Speak a little bit about this, and we're kind of going all over the place in this podcast, which I think is kind of fun, but speak a little bit about H2H's focus away from individual voir dire to group voir dire and why that's so helpful.

Coach Joon:

Yeah. I mean, I think you kind of spoke to it already a little bit, but I mean, when I came to the studio and I first learned about this concept, I was like, that is so amazing, because even if you get a bad juror in your group, guess what? The group will take care of that bad juror, you know? So it was so powerful. I'm like, oh, I don't have to be so scared.

Sari de la Motte:

Yes. Yes. And I think, for us, so many of you are trained to have these little individual conversations.

Coach Joon:

Oh, so--

Sari de la Motte:

You're like, yeah, I've got this group of 12, or 30, or 60, and I'm going to talk to this one person and we're going to have this little conversation and everyone else is going to be so interested in that conversation. And guess what? Nope. And not only that, it's like, you need to train your jurors how to operate as a group because that's what they're going to do in the back room. They don't know how to do that until you train them to do that. So we talk a lot about how to ask group questions, how to throw it back to the group.

In fact, we were just working in the Voir Dire Circle a few weeks ago and how much more efficient this is, because you don't have to go juror, by juror, by juror and ask them, do you agree? Do you disagree? You just go, okay, what does the group think? Let me throw it back to the group, and it really forms your group, and it's so much more efficient for you. And it's what they're going to be doing anyway.

Coach Joon:

That's one of my most favorite techniques I learned in voir dire is the hot potato. It was like just throw it back to the group. Hot potato.

Sari de la Motte:

Absolutely. Absolutely. Every time you feel like you're struggling to come up with another question to ask or that the focus is on you, that is a signal that you need to throw back to the group. The group will always rescue you. They'll rescue everybody. If you know how to form the group, they'll manage themselves. They'll manage the outliers. They'll rescue you.

Oh my God, the power of the jury, we talk about it, but man, there's so much power the minute you start voir dire. It's just, they're so powerful if you know how to use that power.

Coach Joon:

Totally.

Sari de la Motte:

Which hopefully people listening to those podcasts are like, oh my God, how do you do this? And we're like, okay, come join H2H, because the reason I want to do this podcast is people get excited about all these things we talk about. But then they come in and they drag all their old bullshit in and then they get frustrated. And so, you have to empty your cup to come back full circle. You have to come in and go, it's like, you've never been a trial lawyer before. And go, okay, let's start over. And that's not to say that what got you here was bad. I mean, we talk about this too when we're coaching, our private clients, is that we talk about how your saboteur served a purpose, right? It kept you safe. It helped you survive. But when you get to a point where you now recognize your saboteur's no longer serving you and that's no longer the way you want to live, you can let go of it. We don't make it wrong. We don't make it bad. We don't say, oh my God, why was I doing that all this time? What you were doing got you here.

Coach Joon:

Yeah.

Sari de la Motte:

We're not going to make that wrong or bad.

Coach Joon:

Yeah. And what I've heard before is the way you were thinking is what got you here. But that same way of thinking is not going to get you to the next level.

Sari de la Motte:

That's exactly right. And I think that's what people keep trying to do. They keep trying to fit H2H in their old paradigm and then they get frustrated. And so we're saying, we honor the journey you've been on, but now it's time to say goodbye and move to the new journey.

Coach Joon:

Yep. And look, I mean, now having really just taking in H2H and all that stuff, when I look back at some of the old stuff that I've learned, I see it in a different light and I can use it more effectively.

Sari de la Motte:

Yeah. That's what I was just going to end our podcast with. Is do we ever then bring in some of the older things or some of the non-H2H things? Speak to that. Yes. Yes, yes, yes, yes.

Coach Joon:

Yeah. I mean, that's one of the things that I love about H2H. It's H2H and only H2H and this is it. No, it's, hey, it's an entire philosophy. It's an entire process of how do you work through the process and do the work? And you can just get as creative as you want, whether it's H2H incorporated with Mitnick, or Randy McGinn, or. It just opens up. It allows us to open up to so many different things. And that's the beauty of it.

Sari de la Motte:

That's exactly right. So I don't want to leave our listeners with the impression that once you get into H2H, you never use another trial method, or you don't ever try a trick or tip that you learned at a CLE. H2H, to me is once you empty your cup and you kind of like do that mind erase, and you immerse yourself in the mindset work, and you get to a place where you realize trial can be fun. The jurors are not your enemy and you're learning the issue oriented voir dire, and you're learning that the opening template. Then you can look around, you're like a new newborn, right? And you're like, ooh, now I can use this thing that Keith does, or ooh, now I know how to use the rally thing. Because you're not looking at them as techniques anymore. You're looking at them as tools, right? They're tools in your arsenal that are used at a certain time and place. And now, you know where that certain time and place makes sense, because you have a philosophy that you're grounded in, and you're no longer in a fear based place where you're just trying to do whatever you can do.

I mean, Michael Cowen is a great example. He's in trial right now, and he's an H2H-er, and of course we know him as the owner, no, the person behind Trial Lawyer Nation podcast, and he just posted an opening in the H2H Crew that he just did. And it's like, it's all kinds of fun things that he put together. And one of the great things he said is like, I am having so much fun.

Coach Joon:

And isn't that the win in and of itself?

Sari de la Motte:

Yes. Yes.

Coach Joon:

That's awesome.

Sari de la Motte:

So empty your cup my friends. When you come to H2H, we're going to provide the safety for you to let go, but that's your first step, is to let go. Let go of all this other stuff and learn how to trust yourself first. Let the crew come in and support you as you learn how to do that, then you learn how to trust the jury, and then everything else becomes so much more fun.

Well, thank you, Coach Joon for being here. Super fun podcasting with you again. And I also want to let our listeners know that I am booked literally through 2023, right? That's the first option you have to work with me due to cancer and COVID, and the fact that I'm super popular, thank you. But Coach Joon is here to help. So in his busy schedule, he is so helpful to work in the membership, yes, but he is also helping us by taking on consulting clients. So if you want to learn the H2H method with a coach, with a consultant, and help you prepare your issue oriented voir dire, help you prepare your opening statement, even help you deliver it. I mean, he's a nonverbal rock star this guy. You can contact us at, saridlm.com, or just info@saridlm.com. Email us, and we'll connect you with Joon.

And he's obviously connecting with me on different things, so of course I will be involved on some level with that, but he is trained and ready to go, and awesome. So you definitely want to work with Joon and you can even connect with him at Joon, joon@saridm.com if you want to talk to him just one on one.

Sari de la Motte:

All right.

Coach Joon:

All right.

Sari de la Motte:

Thank you for being here. Hope your kids get past some of the swearing we did and are proud of dad for being on a podcast yet again. It's so fun to have you. And we'll talk to everybody next week. Thanks for being here.

Coach Joon:

Thank you Sari.

Sari de la Motte:

Thanks for joining me today. If you benefited from what we talked about, or just want to let me know you enjoy the podcast, go ahead and leave me a review on whichever platform you use to listen to From Hostage to Hero, add a comment and I just might give you a shout on an upcoming episode. In the meantime, head over to fromhostagetohero.com to order your copy of my book, From Hostage to Hero: Captivate the Jury By Setting Them Free, and to get on my mailing list. I send out trial tips and encouragement right to your inbox every single week. And while you're there, make sure you join the wait list to become an H2H Crew member when we reopen. We only open a few times each year and you do not want to miss out. I look forward to our time together in next week's episode, talk then.

If you liked this episode topic, check out these others:

• Episode #97 – Let Go of Results. Focus on THIS Instead
• Episode #158 – True Freedom and How to Get It with Coach Jody, Coach Siria and Sara Williams!
• Episode #150 – Why You Need to Use the “Coffee Rule” in Voir Dire